How far away are a return to Cardiff v Newport derbies?

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8 Responses to How far away are a return to Cardiff v Newport derbies?

  1. Graham says:

    The misery of listening to the game from Port Elizabeth in South Africa was almost total .. but, with you, I welcomed Kadeem Harris’s appearance and work-rate .. and I also wondered why we were playing in white whereas in previous away games when a change was necessary we’d played in blue .. was it an instruction from our absentee owner? So on we must go ..

  2. Dai Woosnam says:

    Thanks Paul and Graham for an interesting read, as ever.
    I won’t comment on the all-white strip, other than it looked as odd on the eye, as the all-red one looks good. I think it was the red trim on the white that looked so peculiar.
    I speak as someone who wishes Mr Tan had stayed with the blue shirt.
    But in saying that, I think he was daft to ever ALLOW the blue as an “away” choice.
    If he was going to make a break, he should then have made it completely.
    But by letting fans see City playing in blue so many times a season, he just allowed the thing to fester even more.
    The analogy would be with someone who says “I am giving up smoking..but I will smoke every other week on Wednesdays only”.
    One is either ON the bus, or NOT on the bus. One cannot be HALF on the bus.
    So allowing “blue” to still be in the Cardiff City spectrum, was yet another error by Mr Tan.
    Now, to change subject: your feeling Paul, that Newport was never a real football town.
    Well you are probably right. But prior to WW2 they used to often get 20,000 attendances at Somerton Park, and I can remember when they were rock bottom of the pyramid in May 1977, being one of well over 8,000 fans to see Colin Addison pull off that miracle and doom opponents Workington Town to non-league football.
    My feeling is that nearly 40 years later, it is more of a football town NOW than then.
    My reasoning is that the growth of towns like Cwmbran, Caerleon, Caldicot and Chepstow (all in the M4 corridor as it enters Wales) has seen lots of incomers who have come with the new technology jobs. And my hunch is these are more SOCCER people than rugby.
    They are just waiting for a Newport County to be proud of …and thus affiliate themselves to.
    Kindest,
    Dai.

  3. Richard Holt says:

    In answer to the question your title posed I would say that a Cardiff-Newport league derby is a hell of a lot closer than a Cardiff-Swansea one. We were very poor for most of the game Paul and only Bournemouth’s rather surprising inability to defend crosses gave the score a more respectable look than it should have been. In fairness Bournemouth were very good going forward and apart from that vulnerability at the back, the best side I’ve seen this season. I wouldn’t be surprised if they win this division with a bit to spare.

  4. The other Bob Wilson says:

    Sorry it’s taken me so long to reply to you and Dai Graham. You are probably aware that there’s been a story in the local media saying that FA rules dictated that we couldn’t wear blue on Saturday, but it’s been pointed out that Ipswich wore blue when they played there recently – here’s the story if you haven’t seen it;-

    http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/bournemouth-v-cardiff-bluebirds-say-8285922#rlabs=3

    Dai, County’s average gate in 1938/39 when they got promoted to the old Second Division was 11,448 which isn’t bad at all on the face of it, but when you consider that, for example, Millwall averaged over 27,000, Luton over 15,000 and Chesterfield over 13,000 that year, it puts things into perspective a bit. I was at that game with Workington and when I went to work the following day, there were four or five people from Cardiff who mentioned to me that they had gone as well – my point being that I believe a fair proportion of that 8,000 weren’t County fans first and foremost. I was also at Somerton Park when they beat us 1-0 on Easter Monday 1983 – there were 16,000 there that day and they looked certs to go up, but that year, when they should have got promoted, they averaged just 4.714 (albeit in a season where gates were low throughout the country). That tends to prove that, historically, Newport is a little like Cardiff in that people will turn up for “big” matches, but disappear again when things become more humdrum (in City’s case 47,000 against Spurs in 1961, then 21,000 less than a fortnight later when they entertained Blackpool) – I always say Newport is like Cardiff only worse!

    Richard, Bournemouth are the best side I’ve seen play us so far and the fact that they had nowhere near their strongest team out the night they embarrassed (or maybe that should be we embarrassed ourselves) in the League Cup suggests they might have the strength in depth to cope with the fatigue which blighted so many of our promotion bids under Dave Jones. One observation I’d make about Saturday though is that three of Bournemouth’s goals came from shots from outside the penalty area and, while I’m not saying for a second that we were unlucky in any way, that does seem a bit freakish to me – it’s that sort of thing that happens when you are on a run like theirs.

    As always, thanks to all of you for your comments.

  5. Dai Woosnam says:

    Thanks, Paul.
    Very impressed with your erudition…but not surprised. I as always SALUTE you for your ability to do the “hard yards”.
    Had no idea that the average gate at Somerton Park in 1938/39 was so low ..just over 11,000.
    I based my comment on the time when I was a regular attender at Somerton Park (1961-64)seeing a glorious team with Len Weare in goal, a dynamic front two in Ralph Hunt and “our” Joe Bonson, a fleet footed left winger in Granville Smith, and the best Scottish wing half I ever saw who never played for his countrY: Andy Bowman.
    And when I was a fan attending almost every home game in that time (as long as they did not clash with a City away game I was off to!), I used to regularly meet up with this old bloke who used to regale me with stories of how full the ground used to be pre War.
    I seem to recall him saying that there were 24 or 25 thousand for one game against City, and several others of 20,000 in that decade.
    Maybe time is playing tricks on me.
    Indeed it must be, as I note you tell me that there were only 47,000 for the epic game when we beat the Spurs “double side” in 1961.
    I was at that game. Unforgettable. Graham Moore and Danny Malloy supreme.
    In the afternoon I attended the Wales – Ireland game at the Arms Park with my ticket that I had got from Mr Jenkins at Porth YMCA.
    Then joined the throng walking across to Ninian Park.
    And that night, the numbers at Ninian were boosted by a huge segment of rugby fans from places like Ystradgynlais and Carmarthen. A couple of them were walking alongside me, and (seeing my City scarf and rattle)asked me the way as they were unsure …they had never been to Ninian before. But the attraction was that dazzling Spurs “Double” side. They remain the finest British team I ever saw.
    I had been at Ninian in over 62,000 people* 18 months before to see the brilliant Jimmy Greaves open the scoring for England in the first half, and my hero Graham Moore score that great headed last minute equaliser. And I have to tell you Paul, that the Spurs game seemed every bit as crowded. There were so many red-and-white rugby scarves in the crowd that night.
    Maybe some of those rugby fans (literally!) took a leaf out of that now becoming infamous Kenny Dalglish book, when he says that Liverpool fans were famous – if they could not get a ticket – for getting into matches without paying at the turnstiles (a claim that is now coming back to haunt him, methinks). For trust me Paul: if the official figure was 47,000 for that Spurs game, then there is something manifestly wrong with that figure.
    Either a lot of people scaled the walls (and we both know that this was basically impossible) or more likely, as Spurs were seen back then as a hugely rich club, some jiggery-pokery went on with that attendance figure (as gate receipts had to be shared back then in the Football League).
    * I have not googled it – deliberate lower case there! – but that figure is as impressed on my memory as the wall was on my chest as I stood right down the front of the Bob Bank in that incredible mass of people.
    Kindest,
    Dai.

  6. The other Bob Wilson says:

    Hello Dai. I know what you mean – did you go to the game with Hereford in 1976 when the crowd announced was 35,000? There are plenty who’ll swear that there were a lot more than that there that night and with people still queuing up to get in half an hour into the match, I wouldn’t be surprised if a few gates were opened to let people in for nothing.
    The biggest crowd I’ve been in for a City home match was at the FA Cup match with Arsenal in 1969 when I think there was 55,000 at Ninian Park, but I’m pretty sure there were a couple of thousand more for the first Wales v England match I saw in 1967.

  7. Dai Woosnam says:

    Thanks Paul…and yes I was at the Hereford game.
    I was high up behind the goal at the Grange End.
    I remember the Alan Campbell goal vividly, but if you put a gun to my head, I cannot recall the other.
    But you are right. 35,000? Who did they think they were kidding?
    For years I used to bang on about the clear discrepancy between what I saw as the attendance figure in the newspaper, and what I knew to be the reality.
    And I am sure it still goes on today.
    Tell me Paul…do they count complimentary tickets in attendance totals?
    I ask, because it is a SCANDAL just how many comps are handed out to ex players – and worse – to millionaire current players and managers!
    I believe EVERYONE should pay. Except actual team personnel. Even newspaper reporters should put their hands in their pockets.
    Why should (sometimes unemployed) fans have to subsidise the rich?

  8. The other Bob Wilson says:

    They were both good goals against Hereford Dai – Livermore’s was what must surely be the only diving header he ever scored in his career!
    I don’t know the answer to the question you ask for certain, but I think complimentary tickets get counted towards the total attendance. I agree with you completely about all the freebees that are handed out – as you say, everyone should pay.
    I remember Sam Hammam saying he would pay for his tickets, food, drink etc. out of his own pocket when he took over – I wonder how long that lasted?

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